Roots Archives Forum

This is one of those threads that just reinforces the decision of people like Bellyman to quit the forum for pastures new.

What makes you refer to these albums as being Overated"? The simple fact that it is your personal preference that you don`t like the songs on these albums as much as you like the songs on other albums. Does that actually make the albums that you list above as being overated? I personally don`t think so.

Albums you mention like "Blackheart Man", "Satta Masagana", "Life Of Contradiction", "Songbook", "King Tubby Meets Rockers Uptown" (and many others I could name) have all been highly rated by people like David Katz, Steve Barrow and others who are well respected authorities on reggae.

So rather than just dismiss them as being overated why not look a bit deeper at the circumstances that has lead to them being so highly rated in the first place. Who knows you may learn something

There is a world of difference between "Overated" and "I personally don`t like"

I probably haven`t explained myself to well but I can certainly understand why these albums have their high status in the annuls of reggae history.

I have to take exception to your comments Rootsman. Since you mention two of the records I talked about, I have to include myself as one of your targets, and it isn't fair or accurate to say these albums were "dismissed." I made substantive comments about my thoughts about the records,including things I appreciated about them and am open and interested in other views on them. It really could be a simple, interesting and unoffensive topic for discussion.

I think maybe this thread was begun less artfully than it could have been, but whatever language you want to use, it's addressing an experience that everyone has probably had:

You hear good things about a record, maybe have seen it on a lot of top ten lists or whatever; you buy it, and you are disappointed in it. It's the kind of thing you sometimes want to talk about when you talk about records.

The fact that this elicits so much negative reaction is really a bit strange, I think. Was there some golden era on this forum where everyone agreed and had the proper opinions on everything?

flashman wrote:It kind of makes me think of it as reggae's Kind of Blue, which is the favorite jazz album of most people who aren't that into jazz, not because it isn't great but because most jazz heads have digested it fully and moved on and gone deeper already.

Alright. Not that anybody cares, but I'll play. Mainly cause this is a subject, in a round about way, that I deal with all the time while talking to non-reggae fans.

Of course you've heard the complaints - "It all sounds the same" a complaint that mainly comes from people whose only exposure to the music is Bob's Legend LP.

Instead of using the term "overrated" I like to think of it as "overexposed." King Tubby Meets Rockers Uptown is a fine, fine album, but sometimes, especially in the music journals and with casual listeners, it seems like the ONLY dub LP ever released. Same with Bunny Wailer's material - again fine, but WHY does it always come back to Bob and the Wailers? Some of us have absorbed the Wailers output and went deeper in and I think that's where the problem lies - some reggae/JA fans have put a lot of time and effort and sweat equity into digging up obscure yet worthy gems only to have the conversation return repeatedly to the same five LPs!

I'm not putting anyone down, or any of the artistes down, but for some of us, this is anything but "casual" listening and I think it's high time we acknowledge the breadth and depth of Jamaican music. While I think Police and Thieves and War Ina Babylon are great, sometimes I think my brothers out there only listen to those Lee Perry productions. There is waaaaay more than Lee Perry and Bob. Why doesn't Alton Ellis get as much love? Or Lone Ranger?

Just a thought. Flame away.

Rootsman wrote:There is a world of difference between "Overated" and "I personally don`t like"...

Feel no way, Rootsman. Your point is well taken, but remember that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, I'm sure that for every album I don't like, there are 3 or 4 that I love. Reggae - and what many consider to be its seminal albums - is not beyond criticism and there is lots of room for personal tastes and opinion. I would rather have a provocative and lively discussion like this than read about Eek A Mouse raping someone.

Mick Sleeper wrote:I would rather have a provocative and lively discussion like this than read about Eek A Mouse raping someone.

Well said

I agree with Franco that some lps are "overexposed" rather than over-rated.Ive been into Reggae now for 15 years and have occasionaly come up against "opinions" like :"All reggae sounds the same" but generally when telling non-Reggae fans that I like Reggae have found a lot of fondness and love for the music.If people only know of Marley I will gently expose them to other Reggae artists and find the reaction is usually favourable.
With any form of music you have to delve deeper to discover the gems.Sure some albums/artistes seem to crop up again and again but imagine/remember what it was like the first time you heard King Tuby Meets Rockers Uptown, didnt it blow your mind just a little?
i remember the first time I played Blackboard Jungle,I had never heard anything like it,it just sounded so alien;the music seemed like it was being played backwards then forwards then everywhich way. That blew my mind.When I first heard Conquering Lion by Yabby & the Prophets I was stunned at how devotional and mystical roots could be.Same with Abbyssinians, Israel Vibration,Congoes. This is not you're average pop music, it is from the Heart & Soul & Mind . If you are only aware of Bob Marleys Legend check out African Herbsman or their Studio One output.
I may occasionally listen to other types of music but Reggae is the one I always come back to.

Marcus Garvey_ Garveys Ghost, I have heard a lot of praise about this album and maybe there is something I'm missing since it seems to be considered a seminal work.

Admittedly I haven't listening to it for a long time. (Since I was a child in fact when my dad used to play it). But I never really was that taken by this album nor Burning Spear generally. I think I can appreciate objectively why they are so big, and such cornerstones but personally I have never been that drawn.

I will have fun over the next few days, going to listen to them again see if, now I'm older, I can appreciate Burning Spear a little better. It works like that with me and Reggae; a record I previously disliked when re-listened to enough times becomes one of my favorites. (E.g. When I first listened to Bobs early work Catch a fire/Burnin/African Herbsman etc.. I never liked them, now I love them.)

I also find Burning Spear nothing special... Except some songs, I think his material is kind of boring... There is another reggae album a lot of people dislike and a lot of people simply love it. Culture's Two Sevens Clash (and Baldhead Bridge). For me these are just two of the finest reggae records, but a lot of my friends (reggae lovers) dislike them.
And just one more... Police in Helicopter, John Holt. I only knew the title track, which for me is one of the greatest songs ever, but the rest of the album is just nothing special, hard to listen to...

MatejkoFarI wrote:Police in Helicopter, John Holt. I only knew the title track, which for me is one of the greatest songs ever, but the rest of the album is just nothing special, hard to listen to...

I don't see what the problem with this thread is - for that matter, I don't see what is wrong with the eek a mouse thread either - it's about time that creep got called out for his horrible behavior.

This John Holt lp is a fine example of 'huh'? It seemed to be getting a lot of mention and attention lately and much like MatejkoFari, I don't see what the excitement is all about, aside from the title track of course. The rest of the lp, blah.

And to tie in eek. He is the perfect example of an overrated artist. He is just lucky the world is full of frat boys and kegs of beer. Take those two things away and he wouldn't have an audience.